Mistreatment of Christians in Egypt frequently meets with indifference – or worse yet, complicity — from Egyptian authorities. In November 2010, Egyptian security forces opened fire on a crowd of unarmed Christians who were protesting against the discrimination and harassment they faced in Egyptian society; four people were killed. In June 2007, rioters in Alexandria vandalized Christian shops, attacked and injured seven Christians, and damaged two Coptic churches. Police allowed the mob to roam free in Alexandria’s Christian quarter for an hour and a half before intervening. The Compass Direct News service, which tracks incidents of Christian persecution, noted: “In April 2006, Alexandria was the scene of three knife attacks on churches that killed one Christian and left a dozen more injured. The government appeared unable or unwilling to halt subsequent vandalism of Coptic-owned shops and churches…”
The ordeal of Suhir Shihata Gouda exemplifies the experience of many Egyptian Christians, and principally of Christian women, who are frequently victimized by Muslim
men. According to the Jubilee Campaign, which records incidences of Christian persecution, a group of Muslims kidnapped Suhir and forced her to marry a Muslim. When her father complained to police, they beat and cursed him instead of registering his complaint. Finally, her new Muslim husband joined a mob that went to her father’s house and threatened to kill all the Christians in the area if the family complained to authorities again.
This persecution combined with denial in Egypt itself is bad enough, but even worse, Muslims are also targeting Copts worldwide. The Canadian Press reported in December 2010 that “the Shumukh-al-Islam website, often considered to be al-Qaeda’s mouthpiece, listed pictures, addresses and cellphone numbers of Coptic Christians, predominantly Egyptian-Canadians, who have been vocal about their opposition to Islam.” Accompanying this information were calls to murder those listed.
And all this has happened while Egypt has been ostensibly a secular state. If the Muslim Brotherhood ultimately succeeds in imposing Sharia in Egypt, Copts may come to look back at the age of Mubarak as the good old days.
Egyptian Copts better be worried. Mubarak’s government was a dictatorship, but not Islamic in law or treatment of relgious minorities. It didn’t let Sharia, or Islamic law in courts and the police kept (mostly) the radical Islamists from killing Christians or holding office.
It looks like the Muslim Brotherhood will have a big role in any new government so Sharia and persecution will soon follow. Obama will be known as letting the Mid East go all radical Islam and all anti-America.
Any type of Christians or Jews will be dead meat in Egypt, Tunisia, Lybia, all the bedraggled states that will become Muslim Theocracies. Hopefully, they'll have the sense to get out while alive and leave these states purely Islamic so that if and when we have to really wipe them out, we won't be harming the oppressed..
Frankly, I don't think we'll have to take action as the factions go after each other. After all, evil does not procreate in that it cannot self sustain. Unlike goodness which will procreate, evil must necessarily kill itself off. Think of it, if evil does something that is "good" for its own sake it is inconsistent within itself. It cannot stand. Although 1400 years seems to be plenty enough time to have eaten its own tail. Maybe we could help just a little…by turning Mecca into glass. Maybe if these folks had to be more concerned with getting food and water they’d be less inclined to look for trouble. I’m just sayin’.
Mohandas Gandhi always claimed that in the end, "evil always loses". However, there is no reason we can't give it a nudge in the direction of the cliff every once and a while.
The immediate future of Egypt looks ominous and the curious might want to compare the present events with the prophecy about Egypt in Isaiah chapter 19.
Everyone honestly thinks that Egypt is going to turn into a Iran-like state. It really isn't like that, and I personally do want egypt to have its christian population and I want them to have every single right alongside the muslims and be equal. The country needs to go on the step of freedom and democracy for ALL egyptian people. Like many protestors have said, it does not matter if you are a Christian, a Muslim, or an Athiest, you will fight for your rights. Egypt may find itself under mass outside interference and problems, and it needs to work for it's citizens, all of them. I have nothing against the christians and I believe that the solution to our problems is working with each other. It is true that the coptics are looked negatively on by some muslims, and I just find that view close-minded, for we are all in this together. I hope egypt select a leader from within, not one who will be another puppet (Lord knows I don't trust Elbaradei), one who will improve things for Egypt and be a man of the people, all of the people. As a side note, however, middle eastern relations are more complicated than they appear. Take Iran for example, It's government is infact MORE against Sunnis than it is against jews and christians. There are thousands of jews (then again the population of Iran is in the millions so we are talking about a small minority here but still) that live there under the protection of the leader who cares about them more than sunni muslims, despite being paid by the Israeli government to go live in Israel. Iran hasn't really even done anything against Israel, for all it's boasting about "Allahu Akabar death to Israel" just didn't bring about anything. Sure, some will say that is because israel is stronger or because Iran is planning for once it has an operational nuclear arsenal. In the end though, I would be disheartened unimaginably if Egypt became the next saudi arabia or Iran or if it went about persecuting the christians. It needs to have freedom of speech and right to assembly as basic gauranteed democratic rights. I know that the large majority of Egypt is muslim, but they need to allow criticism of it's treatment of christians which is true. If they were to treat the Christians better and make them an integrated part of egypt, then the country would be more united and better off. This goes for those in egypt who are athiest as well since Nasser's time. National unity and integrity are going to be more needed than religious fervor.
Well my brother. I wish more people had your mindset.
So in summary, Egypt – for its own sake and that of the rest of the world – needs to become completely secular, abandon the evil of intolerance inherent in the expressed commands of the Koran and Islam’s Sharia law and become a democratic republic, not unlike the United States, where free speech and the free practice of religion are protected by law. This understanding seems to be the foundation of what you're saying here. Yet that, in itself, is radical behavior in the face of 'Islamic world dominance' which is what is preached, more than not, my imams around the world. Those that have spoken as you do and published accordingly have had global death warrants issued by renowned and respected religious leaders of Islam. So one can then conclude that, by what you have said, Islam is incompatible with peaceful co-existence with any other religion.
I wouldn't say that really.
On one hand, while I'll agree that the US has much more secular influence than I like, we are not now, nor have we ever been, a secular State. We're essentially a democratic republic with less religious influence than we could. Much to the chagrin of the secular progressives…..
As to your other concerns, I'm not thrilled with the idea of Egypt as EITHER a wholly secular state OR a wholly Islamic state. For what it's worth, I WOULD like to see Egypt embrace a form of government much alike with our American republican democracy. Regrettably, I think that relatively unlikely.
Even so, I think US government-sponsored intervention would be a serious mistake, unless it's exclusively to secure the continued operation of the Suez. Even that though, poses significant risk. Whatever we do, we're likely to inspire the idea that we're trying to direct Egypt the way we wish, which could well contravene what the People of Egypt want. It'll be very difficult to get involved without violating our own principles of democracy.
I think one of the most important things we CAN do presently is..pray for Egypt and her People. We aren't required to be mired in internal politics by doing that….
The Coptic Church that has already suffered persecution during the reign of Mubarak, will see it increase in intensity if the Muslim Brotherhood take over Egypt. There will be many martyrs, or there will be many forced conversions or both. Their faith will need to be strong when faced with the fanatic hatred of the Fundamentalist Muslims. May the Lord watch over them and protect them.
There are 8 million Coptic Christians. That's more than the entire Jewish population of Israel.
Israel has a certain degree of legitimate suspicion. Also what isn't talked about much is the fact that lots of middle eastern Christians have an ingrained hatred of Israel.
Brigitte Gabriel has spoken of her hatred of the Israelis as a child.
YOu can fool some of the readers….but not this one….You are a liar, creating phony facts." Israel has a certain degree of suspicion"…what the heck does that mean? OH I get it, Israel is concerned about survival…thus, may actually prepare to defend it's women and children. My, how suspicious!!!!
Many middle eastern Christians flocked to Israel to live in security and peace; the Christian communities of most of the hard line Islamic states are under intense pressure to convert or get out. Churches have been destroyed from Bosnia to Afghanistan, in Egypt and in the so called West Bank (Judea and Samaria)…the Christian communities of Bethlehem and Nazareth are under siege .
Brigitte Gabrielle supports Israel and is a patriotic American….not a leftist stooge like you. It was the Israelis who rescued Arab Christians from the predators of Arafat's thug army. She now has an excellent website called ACT…… So Mr. FX GEORGES…….get your facts straight before blowing out your gas on this site.
Israel will take care of all that garbage over there. The muslims will throw rocks – the IDF will throw rockets' red glare. Boom! Ali Akbar and all that… better have those virgins ready to go when the bombs start flying. I say nuke 'em!
I've been wondering how long it'll be before someone suggests US military intervention to this situation. Certainly, many events that begin somewhere halfway around the globe seem to spark US action, especially if economic or political concerns suffer risk. They almost always do.
I dread the consequences of Egypt under Muslim Brotherhood control, but I think we'd best stay out of this as much as possible. Such that we can, anyway. I'm hearing a few thoughts on talk radio that imply that we're already in it (secretly, of course) up to our eyeballs.
Ultimately, US involvement of any kind almost certainly would revolve around the Suez Canal, oil interests, and similar concerns. These are also the problem! We can't afford (literally) to play world cop, I'm afraid. Nor can we afford to attempt spreading the perception that we run a worldwide empire.
We may be able to offer some help by means of religious and civic organizations. I think though, that the second we become formally involved, our credibility in the Arab World will end. ..Assuming it hasn't already.
BTW, I don't think fomenting a Mid-Eastern nuclear shoot-out would help either. That's an awful large number of human beings to kill, evil-minded though many may be.
Aside from that, don't forget that a nuclear exchange with Israel would almost certainly have an impact on various oil fields in the area.
Unless we all REALLY want to pay severely exorbitant prices for gas, I suggest we all keep our "Big Bangs" setting quietly in their silos and launchers.
Egypt has been armed by the US with US grade miltary technology. For us to confront 655,000 Egytiam military armed, just as we will be armed, is a likely way to remove 1.5 million soldiers from the world and start WWIII. One possibility, anyway.
With our president praising their goodness in and for the world, it is unlikely that he will command US tropps to be their undoing.
At the very least, we do run the risk of provoking a regional war, don't we?
Even ignoring humanitarian concerns..
We do anything active, we risk a regional war that could close the Suez and drive oil prices through the roof in general.
If we do nothing, we risk an Islamic Mid-East, hostile to us, that wishes to destabilize us by..collaborating to drive oil prices through the roof.
But we don't have any viable alternative fuels because of 40 years of political manipulation, bickering, and lack of progress.
..But we still can't drill in the Arctic, can we?
A fine pickle.
We can drill anywhere we choose to on US soil. The factions that want us to remain dependent on foreign oil have their own agendas and expect their own rewards, even to the detriment of the US and the world. They would, in essence, hold the quality of life of a caribou above the quality of life of a human. But that’s another issue.
I expect that, if we were to announce that we will be drilling in all the known areas with US territorial borders for the expressed purpose of severing OPEC dependence, we would see a plummeting of oil prices and a stabilization in that sector of the global economy. The political factions within Muslim nations will continue as it has for 1400 years as they continue to decimate all in their paths, regardless of whether they be Christian, Jew or Muslim. Allah is quoted in the Koran as saying that it is his singular intention to “fill hell with jinn (evil spirits) and men”.
To attempt to force democratic principles on a society who’s very Islamic foundation is anathema to peaceful and equal co-existence with other religions, as well as factions within its own, is nothing short of foolhardy; Foolhardy in that such action would show a deep and imperiling lack of understanding of what Islam actually is. Both John Q. Adams and Winston Churchill had a very keen respect for Islam. Read what they had to say on the state of Islam after hundreds and hundreds of years of its existence, as well as the conditions of those countries where Islam is predominant. You can tell a tree by its fruit and the politics of Muslim nations in nothing….nothing like the democratic principles we would want to share, even at the expense of our own American lives.
So, drilling our own oil to stabilize our own prices for our own benefit is about the best thing we could do for ourselves and the rest of the world. Competition in product pricing is always a good thing. Though the cap and tax crowd might disagree, and do so for monetary considerations, I would understand. Nevertheless, only a fool goes broke eating in restaurants when his own cupboard is full to overflowing.